Ask Our Doctors – Archive
Our Medical Directors are outstanding physicians that you will find to be very personable and compassionate, who take care to ensure that you have the most cutting-edge fertility treatments at your disposal. This is your outlet to ask your questions to the doctors.
Dear Dr. Sher,
What is your opinion on baseline (CD3-4) cysts? I had mine today and there is a cyst measuring 27mm. Seems to be functional (?) as estradiol level on CD3 was 60. I was given the option of 21 days of BCP or proceeding with OI. What would you recommend? Haven´t been able to find realiable studies on this.
Thank you so much!
If the estradiol is <70pg/ml, I would suggest they aspirate the cyst and proceed with stimulation/
Geoff Sher
I am 42 yrs old with a previous child 11 years old boy born at 32 wks with birth weight 1 kg placental insufficiency now he is autistic and has severe learning difficulties. I have a past history of thyroidectomy and radiotherapy for papillary carcinoma in 1995. My present history I am hypertensive.my husband is 45. Could you please suggest us is IVF with own egg suitable option for us please guide us
At 42y with your history, perhaps egg donor-IVF would be a wiser decision. Especially if you also have diminished ovarian reserve.
Geoff Sher
Dear Dr Sher,
I was wondering if high level of DHEA (292 ug/dL) can influence egg quality? And if anything can be or should be done to lower DHEA before an IVF cycle? Thanks!
It depends why the level is raised. Are you sure it is not DHEAS? Needless to say if you are taking DHEA…I would suggest you stop. Otherwise, I would use a BCP to suppress FSH.LH and get on with stimulation.
Geoff Sher
Hello Dr.,
I’m looking for some support and prayers. Our one year anniversary is today but I couldn’t be sadder.
I knew I would have issues getting pregnant with my history of endometriosis and the fact that when I was 22 I had to remove my left ovary and tube due to a 13 inch chocolate cyst.
I’ll be 35 in July and he is 37. All my blood work has looked good and his analysis has been excellent.
Our first protocol was 450 Gonal f with 2 vials of menopure. Then 6 days of cetrotide. We triggered with 10,000 of hcg. We stimmed for 13 days. My estrogen spiked so we were told we would do a freeze all. They got 10 out during the retrieval including 1 cyst. Only one fertilized (conventional) the others had too much sperm enter and some just degenerated. Our one though didn’t divide as plan and arrested around day 5. This round was terrible. I felt so sick and developed ohss and was terribly bloated and in pain for 2 weeks after.
For the second time, they had me start estrace and then also had me on 200 mg of coq10 3x/day, dhea 3x/day, prenatal, vitamin d and metformin 500 mg 3x/day (they said this has shown to help those with pcos even though I don’t show signs and do not have diabetes). I also had heard about Brazil nuts so started that too and also went and got accupuncture once a week. For the meds we did 300 of follistim, 4 vials of menopure and cetrotide for Six days ans triggered with hcg. It was 13 days again this time. My estrogen number got high this time but not nearly as much and I wasn’t feeling anywhere near as bad as the first time. They were seeing 10 follicles with 6 being over 15. 3 of those were over 19mm. This time they were going to do icsi.
Our retrieval was Saturday. I was feeling a lot better going in. When I woke up I was in a lot of pain on my right side and they said they had to push or something to get the follicles so that’s why I was sore. They got 8. The other two were empty. I was a bit disappointed but hopeful. This morning we got the call that NONE fertilized and they noted egg quality issues because they were dark and grainy.
I am so upset.
I’ve googled and read conflicting reports on dark and grainy. Do you have experience with this with women who have had stage 4 endometriosis and have had success?
I really want to use my own eggs and am so scared the doctor is going to tell me my only option is donor eggs.
The nurse who called to follow up said the doctor would be calling me when he is back on Tuesday. I’m just so upset and would love some advice if you have experience with a similar situation. I’m just looking for hope. Thank you.
Hi Pinky,
You clearly have advanced endometriosis, and this can have a profound effect on IVF outcome.
1. The Ovarian stimulation Protocol: If indeed you you did hyperstimulate, I would have expected you to have had many more than 10 follicles in your remaining ovary. The fact that this is all you report, suggests to me that your doctor was only referring to those of sufficient size. If so I would have expected there to have been many more and that your peak E2w was probably high and reflective of this as well as the risk of OHSS developing. I would speculate further that if your RE was fearful of your developing OHSS, you might have been triggered either with a lower dosage of hCG (Pregnyl/Profasi/Novarel)…perhaps half the regular dosage of 10,000U), with only 250mcg (rather than 500mcg) of Ovidrel or with an agonist (Lupron/Buserelin). If so, while such action would have reduced the risk to you of OHSS, this, in my opinion would have come at the expense of egg quality. There are definitely other options that in my opinion are preferable, to such an approach. Then there is the protocol for stimulation that needs to be reviewed and likely revised. This might include the method used for preparation (a long Luron protocol versus a short “flare” approach, or an antagonist (Ganirelix/Cetrotide/Orgalutron approach). I would favor the long agonist (Lupron) protocol. Finally, if it were up to me, I would not use such a high dosage of Menopur, favoring use, (predominantly) the use of recombinant FSH (Follistim/Gonal-F or Puregon). The above is the most important consideration in my opinion.
2. Do you still have one or more endometrioma’s. If so, then in my opinion this could also impact egg development…see relevant articles below.
3. Finally, it is important to recognize that women who have endometriosis have about a 1:3 risk of having an immunologic implantation dysfunction (IID)…see below. This is not an of immediate concern, but it would be pivotal to assess this in advance and prepare for selective immunotherapy at FET, in the even IID does indeed exist.
When women with infertility due to endometriosis seek treatment, they are all too often advised to first try ovarian stimulation (ovulation Induction) with intrauterine insemination (IUI) ………as if to say that this would be just as likely to result in a baby as would in vitro fertilization (IVF). Nothing could be further from reality It is time to set the record straight. And hence this blog!
Bear in mind that the cost of treatment comprises both financial and emotional components and that it is the cost of having a baby rather than cost of a procedure. Then consider the fact that regardless of her age or the severity of the condition, women with infertility due to endometriosis are several fold more likely to have a baby per treatment cycle of IVF than with IUI. It follows that there is a distinct advantage in doing IVF first, rather than as a last resort.
So then, why is it that ovulation induction with or without IUI is routinely offered proposed preferentially to women with mild to moderately severe endometriosis? Could it in part be due to the fact that most practicing doctors do not provide IVF services but are indeed remunerated for ovarian stimulation and IUI services and are thus economically incentivized to offer IUI as a first line approach? Or is because of the often erroneous belief that the use of fertility drugs will in all cases induce the release (ovulation) of multiple eggs at a time and thereby increase the chance of a pregnancy. The truth however is that while normally ovulating women (the majority of women who have mild to moderately severe endometriosis) respond to ovarian stimulation with fertility drugs by forming multiple follicles, they rarely ovulate > 1 (or at most 2) egg at a time. This is because such women usually only develop a single dominant follicle which upon ovulating leaves the others intact. This is the reason why normally ovulating women who undergo ovulation induction usually will not experience improved pregnancy potential, nor will they have a marked increase in multiple pregnancies. Conversely, non-ovulating women (as well as those with dysfunctional ovulation) who undergo ovulation induction, almost always develop multiple large follicles that tend to ovulate in unison. This increases the potential to conceive along with an increased risk multiple pregnancies.
So let me take a stab at explaining why IVF is more successful than IUI or surgical correction in the treatment of endometriosis-related infertility:
1.The toxic pelvic factor: Endometriosis is a condition where the lining of the uterus (the endometrium) grows outside the uterus. While this process begins early in the reproductive life of a woman, with notable exceptions, it only becomes manifest in the 2ndhalf of her reproductive life. After some time, these deposits bleed and when the blood absorbs it leaves a visible pigment that can be identified upon surgical exposure of the pelvis. Such endometriotic deposits invariably produce and release toxins” into the pelvic secretions that coat the surface of the membrane (the peritoneum) that envelops all abdominal and pelvic organs, including the uterus, tubes and ovaries. These toxins are referred to as “the peritoneal factor”. Following ovulation, the egg(s) must pass from the ovary (ies), through these toxic secretions to reach the sperm lying in wait in the outer part the fallopian tube (s) tube(s) where, the sperm lie in waiting. In the process of going from the ovary(ies) to the Fallopian tube(s) these eggs become exposed to the “peritoneal toxins” which alter s the envelopment of the egg (i.e. zona pellucida) making it much less receptive to being fertilized by sperm. As a consequence, if they are chromosomally normal such eggs are rendered much less likely to be successfully fertilized. Since almost all women with endometriosis have this problem, it is not difficult to understand why they are far less likely to conceive following ovulation (whether natural or induced through ovulation induction). This “toxic peritoneal factor impacts on eggs that are ovulated whether spontaneously (as in natural cycles) or following the use of fertility drugs and serves to explain why the chance of pregnancy is so significantly reduced in normally ovulating women with endometriosis.
2.The Immunologic Factor: About one third of women who have endometriosis will also have an immunologic implantation dysfunction (IID) linked to activation of uterine natural killer cells (NKa). This will require selective immunotherapy with Intralipid infusions, and/or heparinoids (e.g. Clexane/Lovenox) that is much more effectively implemented in combination with IVF.
3.Surgical treatment of mild to moderate endometriosis does not usually improve pregnancy potential:. The reason is that endometriosis can be considered to be a “work in progress”. New lesions are constantly developing. So it is that for every endometriotic seen there are usually many non-pigmented deposits that are in the process of evolving but are not yet visible to the naked eye and such evolving (non-visible) lesions can also release the same “toxins that compromise fertilization. Accordingly, even after surgical removal of all visible lesions the invisible ones continue to release “toxins” and retain the ability to compromise natural fertilization. It also explains why surgery to remove endometriotic deposits in women with mild to moderate endometriosis usually will fail to significantly improve pregnancy generating potential. In contrast, IVF, by removing eggs from the ovaries prior to ovulation, fertilizing these outside of the body and then transferring the resulting embryo(s) to the uterus, bypasses the toxic pelvic environment and is therefore is the treatment of choice in cases of endometriosis-related infertility.
4.Ovarian Endometriomas: Women, who have advanced endometriosis, often have endometriotic ovarian cysts, known as endometriomas. These cysts contain decomposed menstrual blood that looks like melted chocolate…hence the name “chocolate cysts”. These space occupying lesions can activate ovarian connective tissue (stroma or theca) resulting in an overproduction of male hormones (especially testosterone). An excess of ovarian testosterone can severely compromise follicle and egg development in the affected ovary. Thus there are two reasons for treating endometriomas. The first is to alleviate symptoms and the second is to optimize egg and embryo quality. Conventional treatment of endometriomas involves surgical drainage of the cyst contents with subsequent removal of the cyst wall (usually by laparoscopy), iIncreasing the risk of surgical complications. We recently reported on a new, effective and safe outpatient approach to treating endometriomas in women planning to undergo IVF. We termed the treatment ovarian Sclerotherapy. The process involves; needle aspiration of the “chocolate colored liquid content of the endometriotic cyst, followed by the injection of 5% tetracycline hydrochloride into the cyst cavity. Such treatment will, more than 75% of the time result in disappearance of the lesion within 6-8 weeks. Ovarian sclerotherapy can be performed under local anesthesia or under conscious sedation. It is a safe and effective alternative to surgery for definitive treatment of recurrent ovarian endometriomas in a select group of patients planning to undergo IVF
I am not suggesting that all women with infertility-related endometriosis should automatically resort to IVF. Quite to the contrary…. In spite of having reduced fertility potential, many women with mild to moderate endometriosis can and do go on to conceive on their own (without treatment). It is just that the chance of this happening is so is much lower than normal.
I strongly recommend that you visit http://www.DrGeoffreySherIVF.com. Then go to my Blog and access the “search bar”. Type in the titles of any/all of the articles listed below, one by one. “Click” and you will immediately be taken to those you select. Please also take the time to post any questions or comments with the full expectation that I will (as always) respond promptly.
•The IVF Journey: The importance of “Planning the Trip” Before Taking the Ride”
•Controlled Ovarian Stimulation (COS) for IVF: Selecting the ideal protocol
•IVF: Factors Affecting Egg/Embryo “competency” during Controlled Ovarian Stimulation (COS)
•The Fundamental Requirements For Achieving Optimal IVF Success
•Use of GnRH Antagonists (Ganirelix/Cetrotide/Orgalutron) in IVF-Ovarian Stimulation Protocols.
•Anti Mullerian Hormone (AMH) Measurement to Assess Ovarian Reserve and Design the Optimal Protocol for Controlled Ovarian Stimulation (COS) in IVF:
•The Role of Immunologic Implantation Dysfunction (IID) & Infertility (IID):PART 1-Background
•Immunologic Implantation Dysfunction (IID) & Infertility (IID):PART 2- Making a Diagnosis
•Immunologic Dysfunction (IID) & Infertility (IID):PART 3-Treatment
•Thyroid autoantibodies and Immunologic Implantation Dysfunction (IID)
•Immunologic Implantation Dysfunction: Importance of Meticulous Evaluation and Strategic Management:(Case Report
•Intralipid and IVIG therapy: Understanding the Basis for its use in the Treatment of Immunologic Implantation Dysfunction (IID)
•Intralipid (IL) Administration in IVF: It’s Composition; How it Works; Administration; Side-effects; Reactions and Precautions
•Natural Killer Cell Activation (NKa) and Immunologic Implantation Dysfunction in IVF: The Controversy!
•Treating Out-of-State and Out-of-Country Patients at Sher-IVF in Las Vegas
•Should IVF Treatment Cycles be provided uninterrupted or be Conducted in 7-12 Pre-scheduled “Batches” per Year
•A personalized, stepwise approach to IVF
•How Many Embryos should be transferred: A Critical Decision in IVF.
•Endometriosis and Immunologic Implantation Dysfunction (IID) and IVF
•Endometriosis and Infertility: Why IVF Rather than IUI or Surgery Should be the Treatment of Choice.
•Endometriosis and Infertility: The Influence of Age and Severity on Treatment Options
•Early -Endometriosis-related Infertility: Ovulation Induction (with or without Intrauterine Insemination) and Reproductive Surgery Versus IVF
•Treating Ovarian Endometriomas with Sclerotherapy.
•Effect of Advanced Endometriosis with Endometriotic cysts (Endometriomas) on IVF Outcome & Treatment Options.
•Deciding Between Intrauterine Insemination (IUI) and In Vitro Fertilization (IVF).
•Intrauterine Insemination (IUI): Who Needs it & who Does Not: Pro’s &
•Induction of Ovulation With Clomiphene Citrate: Mode of Action, Indications, Benefits, Limitations and Contraindications for its ue
•Clomiphene Induction of Ovulation: Its Use and Misuse!
If you are interested in my advice or medical services, I urge you to contact my concierge, Julie Dahan ASAP to set up a Skype or an in-person consultation with me. You can also contact Julie by phone or via email at 702-533-2691/ Julied@sherivf.com. You can also apply online at http://www.SherIVF.com.
Also, my book, “In Vitro Fertilization, the ART of Making Babies” is available as a down-load through http://www.Amazon.com or from most bookstores and public libraries.
Geoffrey Sher MD
dr. sorry I asked this quest. before but couldn t understand the answer.Is a day 3 , 8 cell, 2nd quality, trisomy 5 embryo ( my dr said it was toooo weak ) okey to transferr ? I read somewhere that sometimes trisomy 5 is related with leukemia .
I would do so, in the hope that it is a “mosaic”, but I would 1st grow it to blastocyst and only do the transfer if it develops into a blastocyst by day 5-6.
Human embryo development occurs through a process that encompasses reprogramming, sequential cleavage divisions and mitotic chromosome segregation and embryonic genome activation. Chromosomal abnormalities may arise during germ cell and/or pre-implantation embryo development, and represents a major cause of early pregnancy loss. About a decade ago, I and an associate, Levent Keskintepe Ph.D were the first to introduce full embryo karyotyping (identification of all 46 chromosomes) through preimplantation genetic sampling (PGS) as a method by which to selectively transfer only euploid embryos (i.e. those that have a full component of chromosomes) to the uterus. We subsequently reported on a 2-3 fold improvement in implantation and birth rates as well as a significant reduction in early pregnancy loss, following IVF. Since then PGS has grown dramatically in popularity such that it is now widely used throughout the world.
Most IVF programs that offer PGS services, require that all participating patients consent to all their aneuploid embryos (i.e. those with an irregular quota of chromosomes) be disposed of. However, there is now growing evidence to suggest that following embryo transfer, some aneuploid embryos will in the process of ongoing development, convert to the euploid state (i.e. “autocorrection”) and then go on to develop into chromosomally normal offspring. In fact, I am personally aware of several such cases occurring within our IVF network. So clearly , summarily discarding all aneuploid embryos as a matter of routine we are sometimes destroying some embryos that might otherwise have “autocorrected” and gone on to develop into normal offspring.
Thus by discarding aneuploid embryos the possibility exists that we could be denying some women the opportunity of having a baby. This creates a major ethical and moral dilemma for those of us that provide the option of PGS to our patients. On the one hand, we strive “to avoid knowingly doing harm” (the Hippocratic Oath) and as such would prefer to avoid or minimize the risk of miscarriage and/or chromosomal birth defects and on the other hand we would not wish to deny patients with aneuploid embryos, the opportunity to have a baby.
The basis for such embryo “autocorrection” lies in the fact that some embryos found through PGS-karyotyping to harbor one or more aneuploid cells (blastomeres) will often also harbor chromosomally normal (euploid) cells (blastomeres). The coexistence of both aneuploid and euploid cells coexisting in the same embryo is referred to as “mosaicism.” As stated, some mosaic embryos will In the process of subsequent cell replication convert to the normal euploid state (i.e. autocorrect)
It is against this background, that an ever increasing number of IVF practitioners, rather than summarily discard PGS-identified aneuploid embryos are now choosing to cryobanking (freeze-store) certain of them, to leave open the possibility of ultimately transferring them to the uterus. In order to best understand the complexity of the factors involved in such decision making, it is essential to understand the causes of embryo aneuploidy of which there are two varieties:
1.Meiotic aneuploidy” results from aberrations in chromosomal numerical configuration that originate in either the egg (most commonly) and/or in sperm, during preconceptual maturational division (meiosis). Since meiosis occurs in the pre-fertilized egg or in and sperm, it follows that when aneuploidy occurs due to defective meiosis, all subsequent cells in the developing embryo/blastocyst/conceptus inevitably will be aneuploid, precluding subsequent “autocorrection”. Meiotic aneuploidy will thus invariably be perpetuated in all the cells of the embryo as they replicate. It is a permanent phenomenon and is irreversible. All embryos so affected are thus fatally damaged. Most will fail to implant and those that do implant will either be lost in early pregnancy or develop into chromosomally defective offspring (e.g. Down syndrome, Edward syndrome, Turner syndrome).
2.“Mitotic aneuploidy” occurs when following fertilization and subsequent cell replication (cleavage), some cells (blastomeres) of a meiotically euploid early embryo mutate and become aneuploid. This is referred to as mosaicism. Thereupon, with continued subsequent cell replication (mitosis) the chromosomal make-up (karyotype) of the embryo might either comprise of predominantly aneuploid cells or euploid cells. The subsequent viability or competency of the conceptus will thereupon depend on whether euploid or aneuploid cells predominate. If in such mosaic embryos aneuploid cells predominate, the embryo will be “incompetent”). If (as is frequently the case) euploid cells prevail, the mosaic embryo will be “competent” and capable of propagating a normal conceptus.
Since some mitotically aneuploid (“mosaic”) embryos can, and indeed do “autocorrect’ while meiotically aneuploid embryos cannot, it follows that an ability to differentiate between these two varieties of aneuploidy would be of considerable clinical value. And would provide a strong argument in favor of preserving certain aneuploid embryos for future dispensation.
Aneuploidy, involves the addition (trisomy) or subtraction (monosomy) of one chromosome in a given pair. As previously stated, some aneuploidies are meiotic in origin while others are mitotic “mosaics”. Certain aneuploidies involve only a single, chromosome pair (simple aneuploidy) while others involve more than a single pair (i.e. complex aneuploidy). Aside from monosomy involving absence of the y-sex chromosome (i.e. XO) which can resulting in a live birth (Turner syndrome) all monosomies involving autosomes (non-sex chromosomes) are lethal and will not result in viable offspring). Some autosomal meiotic aneuploidies, especially trisomies 13, 18, 21, can progress to viable, but severely chromosomally defective babies. All other meiotic autosomal trisomies will almost invariably, either not attach to the uterine lining or upon attachment, will soon be rejected. All forms of meiotic aneuploidy are irreversible while mitotic aneuploidy (“mosaicism) often autocorrects in the uterus. Most complex aneuploidies are meiotic in origin and will almost invariably fail to propagate viable pregnancies.
There is presently no microscopic or genetic test that can reliable differentiate between meiotic and mitotic aneuploidy. Notwithstanding this, the fact that some “mosaic” embryos can autocorrect in the uterus, makes a strong argument in favor of transferring aneuploid of embryos in the hope that the one(s) transferred might be “mosaic” and might propagate viable healthy pregnancies. On the other hand, it is the fear that embryo aneuploidy might result in a chromosomally abnormal baby that has led many IVF physicians to strongly oppose the transfer of any aneuploid embryos to the uterus.
While certain meiotic aneuploid trisomies (e.g. trisomies 13, 18, & 21) can and sometimes do result in chromosomally defective babies, no other meiotic autosomal trisomies can do so. Thus the transfer of trisomic embryos in the hope that one or more might be mosaic, should exclude the use of embryos with trisomies 13, 18 or 21. Conversely, no autosomal monosomic embryos are believed to be capable of resulting in viable pregnancies, thereby making the transfer of autosomally monosomic embryos, in the hope that they are “mosaic”, a far less risky proposition. Needless to say, if such action is being contemplated, it is absolutely essential to make full disclosure to the patient (s) , and to insure the completion of a detailed informed consent agreement which would include a commitment by the patient (s) to undergo prenatal genetic testing aimed at excluding a chromosomal defect in the developing baby and/or a willingness to terminate the pregnancy should a serious birth defect be diagnosed.
Geoff Sher